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You can’t convince me that I-4 isn’t the worst road ever | Articles

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That CR-V is giving off some serious Big Altima Energy™.

I hate I4 with a passion I rarely apply to other things in my life.

Went to visit my gf’s family the other weekend in Titusville.  From St Pete you pretty much drive straight across.

I made up an errand in Lecanto, then took surface roads across the state in order to avoid I4.  Probably should have taken 192 across.

 

berkeley I4.

In reply to Mr_Asa :

I used to be petrified to drive I-4 (I got caught in one too many accidents), though I’ve since gotten more comfortable after I drove in L.A. traffic.

Even then, I still try to avoid I-4 if I can help it.

It’s basically like driving in LA, except everyone is 40 years older and driving bigger, heavier cars.

Come to my neighborhood in Detroit and you will revise your opinion of what awful and dangerous driving looks like. 

I can’t imagine that I4 is any worse than I26 in South Carolina. 

The fast lane running 90. The slow lane running 60. Oh, you wanted a middle lane? Funny boy, we don’t spend money to fix the gargantuan holes or fill the ruts that are literally worn into the asphalt, much less add another lane. 

The 100-mile stretch of I26 between Charleston and Columbia had just shy of 900 crashes that put almost 1200 people in the hospital and killed 33. I pretty much don’t drive on it anymore. Hwy 176 parallels it and you stand a much smaller chance of crashing or getting stuck in traffic for hours. 

I remember I was in Tampa for work and had tickets for the 500 so it was easy to just run across I4. I had a 90s base Corolla as a rental. 

Holy cow. I had grannies blowing my doors off at 80-90 MPH. My poor Corolla couldn’t keep up. It was just crazy. I’ve been all over the US and that is easy top 5 roads I want to avoid. 


aw614


aw614


HalfDork


11/8/23 1:32 p.m.

The Championsgate exist is the worst! If I have an autocross at OCCC, the drive there early in the morning isn’t bad, coming home almost always is a stop and go mess. I think I’ve only been able to get by that mess during the day without traffic only once. I left an autocross at 3pm on Sunday and the slowest it got through there was about 50 mph rolling traffic, but I was surprised I didn’t get stuck. 

Once I get past Championsgate its usually smooth sailing when I come home from the Orlando area, a bit aggressive and fast, but I rather deal with that than sitting in bumper to bumper traffic from pretty much the convention center to Championsgate. 

That being said, since I live 15 miles north of I75 and I4, sometimes its just as fast to go home via the back roads via the Turnpike into Clermont and take SR50 to I75.

Both times on my trip to and from New Smyrna Beach back in late Sept, I took I75 to SR50 and up some route that takes me through the same roads I would take to go to a Martin Sports Car Club autocross. Outside of dealing with people driving 5-10 mph below speed limit in the back roads, its not a bad drive that is scenic and has some fun central Florida rolling hills. And the part of I4 I got back on near Sanford and Lake Mary wasn’t bad. 

By the time racing is done at Orlando BMX I’m usually headed home around midnight on Saturday.   I hit a stopped wall of traffic every time as soon as I get on I 4.   How the hell does it manage to stay stopped 24hrs a day?  Then when you get out my way in Tampa you have the wonderful malfunction junction….the crown jewel of the I 4 experience. 

msterbee said:

Come to my neighborhood in Detroit and you will revise your opinion of what awful and dangerous driving looks like. 

haha  THREE ONE THREE MOTHERberkeleyER!!!

also, i-85 through Greenville SC is a bit of a nightmare as well

#1 Deadlist Road, 2021

I drive it frequently.  Its always terrible, its always under construction.  I do everything I can to avoid it when possible.

I used to blame I-4. Then i realized its not i4. Its a “straight” road, 3-4 lanes for most if it. Nothing really difficult. Its the drivers. The TERRIBLE drivers, the ones who’s time it so much more important than everyone elses. The drivers that park it in the left lane regardless of how slow they are going, how many people they are holding up, how many people honk, cut them off, etc. nope, just gonna stay in the left lane. 
 

then there is the RIGHT lane. Got a on ramp coming up? You could be slightly courteous and give room to the people needing to merge on, but why would you do that?  No, lets just sit in the right lane and ignore the merging cars on your right. Yes, you could easily merge left and give room, but thats too difficult.  
 

think any enforcement will help? Nope. They park it in the left lane too. 


 

i used to commute daily on a terrible stretch of i4. The amount of crappy drivers ive seen is amazing.  But the road itself, nah, no probs.  So far ive managed to drive down a straight/multi lane road without loosing control. 

South bound I-75 in Michigan on a Sunday afternoon when so many people are coming home from “being up north” over the weekend at their cottages or just getting away. Slow lane is 90 mph, the other two lanes usually are 95 mph or over and are SUVs, giant pick ups and RV’s pulling boats, campers, trailers, toys etc. Did that once, got caught in the fast lane, had an RV’s grill in my rear view mirror. Had to drive 105 mph to get a space to move back over to the right lane. Never again.

Never new a RV could go that fast. I know they could not have stopped if I had to.

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

To be fair, it’s up to the merging driver to speed up or slow down and safely make the merge.


DavyZ


DavyZ


New Reader


11/8/23 2:02 p.m.

The old part of Hwy 101 in CA between San Jose and Gilroy was known as “Blood Alley” for all of the accidents there.  They finally reconfigured the highway and made it a genuine freeway, which did help matters a ton.  

Here in NC, I am not a fan of I-85 anywhere to the west of I-77.  It just sucks to drive that thing.  Also, I-77 through Charlotte (any-frikken-where) and going down to Rock Hill, SC.

Congestion, bad driving, expedient maneuvers, hot tempers, entitled idiots all add up to potential mayhem. 

 

In reply to z31maniac :

True, but there is no reason to be a schmuck and “stand your ground”.  With everything, even a little tiny bit of consideration goes a long way.  Sometimes there isn’t an option to “get out of the way”, but you can make room to help accomodate. 
 

a younger me was THE ASSHOLE on i4. Anxiety fueled road rager. Got past that and for a long time now, im the guy that lets you in, makes room, gets out of the way, etc. id rather be the reason someone has a good day than be the reason someone gets all road ragey and pissed off. 

I live in the ‘burbs of Philadelphia and I’ve seen some Sh** around here (including, as mentioned in the article, being passed while in the left lane at high speed by a car in the breakdown lane).  Further, I well understand the comment about have to accelerate to supra-legal speeds just to get the right before being slammed by, for example, a Dodge Ram that thinks it’s a Formula 1 car.  People are either not paying attention, are suicidal, or have not the barest understanding of physics.  Me, I’m just trying to get to my destination in one piece by preserving the safety bubble around my car.


aw614


aw614


HalfDork


11/8/23 2:22 p.m.

z31maniac said:

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

To be fair, it’s up to the merging driver to speed up or slow down and safely make the merge.

That is too much to ask for, for many of the dumb Florida drivers. 

The only redeeming quality of I-4 is that you get to look over at Fantasy of Flight half way across..

I’ve been to the museum, and I’ve met Mrs. Weeks.

I’d highly recommend either one.

 

In reply to aw614 :

So many times ive had someone doing maybe 40mph when its time to merge into traffic(65mph+), then just slam on the brakes at the last second because they cant figure out merging. 
 

i guess i always assume the other drivers are drunk, stupid, asleep, staring at their phone, on a phone call, etc and account for it. I’ll get out of the way so you go on and GTFO of my way. 


kaybat


kaybat


New Reader


11/8/23 2:28 p.m.

It’s the reason i never go to Sebring, getting there is a nightmare.

I agree that I-4 is the worst highway I’ve ever seen.  And that’s because I get to see many of those people driving through Atlanta on their way down.  Little known fact: our HOV in the left lane of I-75 was put there specifically for Florida tags, since they’re going to drive 50mph in the left lane no matter what.  The actual passing lane is for road-raged people with Michigan tags to go 95mph with a carload of screaming brats after not sleeping for 24 hours.

I used to have to commute from Daytona to Lake Mary and back every day on I-4 and it made me want to d*e. We need to replace that road with a train.


Warlock


Warlock


New Reader


11/8/23 2:39 p.m.

The problem with I-4 isn’t when things are moving…it’s the sections that lock up for miles, for no discernable reason.  Highways around DC are the same way.

SR 589 (Veterans Parkway) on the Tampa end gets pretty sporty in the mornings…everything from sport bikes to tradesmen’s trucks with ladders hanging on the side doing the speed of heat until you hit the I-275 exit at the end.  At that point, the two exit lanes essentially stop, and the through lanes to the left continue howling by until they reach the traffic light, with excitement generated by people who want to switch from one to the other.  But pretty much any highway in Florida is wacky…it’s like everyone else sends their worst drivers down here.  

 

I’ve driven a LOT of roads in the US. At least one road in every state. I-4? That’s what y’all think is bad? It ain’t as bad as Atlanta in the early 90’s with construction through town down to two lanes. Or Chicago on a Sunday afternoon. Or LA pretty much any day at some point. DC’s 495 in a blinding downpour and everyone still trying to run 90. Jersey turnpike every damn day of the week. Those people are insane. DFW in the last 10 years… Houston now. Penn turnpike. 

I-4 ain’t that bad in comparison. At least you’re JUST dealing with the morons and not trying to also avoid the craters that used to be the road as well. Just last month I watched a car literally go airborn on I65 south of E-town hitting a messed up concrete patch while running 90+. At least 6″ of air under all four tires. When they landed jumped 3 lanes to pass more cars. It was an Altima. 

I have to leave Daytona after work friday and drive to Fort Meyers. In the Miata. You guys are scaring me (not that I didn’t know all of this).

Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) said:

I have to leave Daytona after work friday and drive to Fort Meyers. In the Miata. You guys are scaring me (not that I didn’t know all of this).

Nice, you will be there too. I have to drive down 75 to get there which usually isn’t any better but I’m going down Saturday morning so hopefully at 5am I don’t hit any traffic. 

z31maniac said:

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

To be fair, it’s up to the merging driver to speed up or slow down and safely make the merge.

This is certainly true…  to a point.  If traffic is bumper to bumper and creeping along, no change of speed on the part of the merging traffic is going to magically open a car-sized hole.  It’s up to those drivers in the right lane to courteously allow merging traffic to merge.

In reply to 1988RedT2 :

that’s when having a beat up work truck comes in handy, people tend to make room


944DR


944DR


None


11/8/23 4:53 p.m.

In reply to Toyman! :Immediately as I read this article I thought of I-95 in South Carolina!

 

Toyman! said:

I can’t imagine that I4 is any worse than I26 in South Carolina. 

The fast lane running 90. The slow lane running 60. Oh, you wanted a middle lane? Funny boy, we don’t spend money to fix the gargantuan holes or fill the ruts that are literally worn into the asphalt, much less add another lane. 

The 100-mile stretch of I26 between Charleston and Columbia had just shy of 900 crashes that put almost 1200 people in the hospital and killed 33. I pretty much don’t drive on it anymore. Hwy 176 parallels it and you stand a much smaller chance of crashing or getting stuck in traffic for hours. 

No, I4 is tons worse.  As someone above said, you can go through Orlando at 1-2 in the morning and will just stop for NO REASON!  I95 in SC is laughable.  Annoying, yes, but not as bad as I4.  

Haven’t driven many big cities (DC, LA, DFW), but I4 is terrible for the 30 miles around Orlando.  I77 through Charlotte sucks too, but I4 still beats it.  

gixxeropa said:

In reply to 1988RedT2 :

that’s when having a beat up work truck comes in handy, people tend to make room

Let me tell you about my beat up motorhome …

I drive I-4 regularly, maybe 2-3 times a week. I feel your pain.

Having said that, allow me to nominate…

 

 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

also, i-85 through Greenville SC is a bit of a nightmare as well

Toyman! said:

I can’t imagine that I4 is any worse than I26 in South Carolina. 

The fast lane running 90. The slow lane running 60. Oh, you wanted a middle lane? Funny boy, we don’t spend money to fix the gargantuan holes or fill the ruts that are literally worn into the asphalt, much less add another lane. 

The 100-mile stretch of I26 between Charleston and Columbia had just shy of 900 crashes that put almost 1200 people in the hospital and killed 33. I pretty much don’t drive on it anymore. Hwy 176 parallels it and you stand a much smaller chance of crashing or getting stuck in traffic for hours. 

As a native South Carolinaian I’ve driven I26, I85, and I4.  berkeley the berkeley out of I4.  I’ll take I26 and I85 anyday over I4.


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/8/23 6:28 p.m.

i-4 is unique in that virtually nowhere else on earth will you encounter the sheer variety of drivers you will here. 

 

Remember, less than 40% of florida’s population is native to florida by birth. That means at any given time 60% or MORE of the people got their drivers license SOMEWHERE ELSE. They did not learn the intricacies of Florida driving. 

 

We also have the added benefit of being effectively the #1 tourist destination on earth, with i-4 passing past….all of it. If you wanna see the mouse, the minions, the whale, or any of it, you’re on I-4.

 

Let’s extrapolate that and add in the fact that…everyone hates tourists. So we all drive like we’re trying to kill them, because let’s be real, some of us are. Tourists drive like they paid for the section of road they’re on so they can do what they want with it. It’s a bad mix. 

 

Add in the fact that I-4 was never designed to do what it’s doing right now, let alone what it’s going to continue to do…forever. The Ultimate project won’t catch up. It’ll finish and we’ll have to start over again. And that’s all I can say about that without patio’ing this whole thing. 

 

There’s a reason I drive junk. I’m prepared to total my car on a daily basis. Ain’t worth owning something I like. 

Mndsm said:

i-4 is unique in that virtually nowhere else on earth will you encounter the sheer variety of drivers you will here. 

 

Remember, less than 40% of florida’s population is native to florida by birth. That means at any given time 60% or MORE of the people got their drivers license SOMEWHERE ELSE. They did not learn the intricacies of Florida driving. 

 

We also have the added benefit of being effectively the #1 tourist destination on earth, with i-4 passing past….all of it. If you wanna see the mouse, the minions, the whale, or any of it, you’re on I-4.

 

Let’s extrapolate that and add in the fact that…everyone hates tourists. So we all drive like we’re trying to kill them, because let’s be real, some of us are. Tourists drive like they paid for the section of road they’re on so they can do what they want with it. It’s a bad mix. 

 

Add in the fact that I-4 was never designed to do what it’s doing right now, let alone what it’s going to continue to do…forever. The Ultimate project won’t catch up. It’ll finish and we’ll have to start over again. And that’s all I can say about that without patio’ing this whole thing. 

 

There’s a reason I drive junk. I’m prepared to total my car on a daily basis. Ain’t worth owning something I like. 

Never in my 42 years on this planet have I heard anything described more accurately. 

I-4 made me coin the term “mystery traffic”. 
 

you can be going along great, 80mph, then traffic  slows, slower and dead stop. Sit stopped for a few seconds, start off again, slow,  speed up and find NOTHING that would have caused a slowdown. No debris in the road, no wreck, no car on the side. Nothing. Its the ol’ i4 mystery traffic. 
 

also, driving a s-box does help. If you are in a nice vehicle, people know you dont want it messed up. You drive a beater, people give you room. My cousin drives the same stretch i used to drive. In his shiny passat r line, he got no respect. In his shiny f-150, he gets a little. In his wacky gambler jeep, he gets all the room.  
 

i had a lady in a nice porsche, 100k$+ car all day. She got way up my ass to intimidate me in my ragged truck ive had for 23 years.  She backed off pretty quick i think after estimating the value of my truck compared to hers. Buy 50 of my truck for 1 of her car. 

TJL (Forum Supporter) said:

I-4 made me coin the term “mystery traffic”. 
 

you can be going along great, 80mph, then traffic  slows, slower and dead stop. Sit stopped for a few seconds, start off again, slow,  speed up and find NOTHING that would have caused a slowdown. No debris in the road, no wreck, no car on the side. Nothing. Its the ol’ i4 mystery traffic. 
 

also, driving a s-box does help. If you are in a nice vehicle, people know you dont want it messed up. You drive a beater, people give you room. My cousin drives the same stretch i used to drive. In his shiny passat r line, he got no respect. In his shiny f-150, he gets a little. In his wacky gambler jeep, he gets all the room.  
 

i had a lady in a nice porsche, 100k$+ car all day. She got way up my ass to intimidate me in my ragged truck ive had for 23 years.  She backed off pretty quick i think after estimating the value of my truck compared to hers. Buy 50 of my truck for 1 of her car. 

Solid advice.  I always think that when people want to get aggressive on the road.   My car has the blue book value of a half eaten pub sub….you really wanna do this?

AGREE! I commute from Daytona to MCO daily and I go straight down 95 from the house and cut across 528. Takes an extra 15 minutes but saves years on my sanity levels! 

I spent time in Orlando I’m the Navy.  I-4 is bad, but I think I-75 through Atlanta is worse.  I-20 through Birmingham is a special kind of awful too (Atlanta drivers).  I-75 in Chattanooga also gets a lot of Atlanta flair at the wheel.


Tom1200


Tom1200


PowerDork


11/8/23 9:09 p.m.

I-15 between Barstow California and Las Vegas.

The road itself is fine but the drivers are homicidal. Passing in the truck lane up at 85-90 mph.

I’ve driven I-4 and it doesn’t compare………..

I-4 does totally suck, and it’s part of my commute but usually the slow downs are accidents are actually on 408.  It’s like a magnet for idiots. 

Meh… Growing up just outside DC I was used to crazy traffic.  In Florida I commuted I-4 from the Daytona area to Orlando for 5 years daily and about ten total years of 40-50k miles a year driving all around central Florida.  Compared to DC traffic it was a cake walk. 

Personally I think traffic and drivers are all what you make of it.  If you are used to it and expect it then it won’t upset you.  If you are high strung or anxious already that will add to it.  If you don’t experience it often you probably feel like you’ve entered some sort of twilight zone hell.

Tom1200 said:

I-15 between Barstow California and Las Vegas.

The road itself is fine but the drivers are homicidal. Passing in the truck lane up at 85-90 mph.

I’ve driven I-4 and it doesn’t compare………..

Some drive 172 while under the influence on that one.  
 

I-4 is it’s own odd thing.  Going along great…..  then it’s all stop!  For what!  Oh it’s a foreigner in a rental with FL plates that just decided to stop suddenly from 70. 

Props to Colin for the artwork on this piece, down to the I-4 Eyesore. A+ job, Colin. 

I nominate I40 through Knoxville. Everything already explained happens everyday. 5 lanes solid of traffic.

Stampie said:

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

also, i-85 through Greenville SC is a bit of a nightmare as well

Toyman! said:

I can’t imagine that I4 is any worse than I26 in South Carolina. 

The fast lane running 90. The slow lane running 60. Oh, you wanted a middle lane? Funny boy, we don’t spend money to fix the gargantuan holes or fill the ruts that are literally worn into the asphalt, much less add another lane. 

The 100-mile stretch of I26 between Charleston and Columbia had just shy of 900 crashes that put almost 1200 people in the hospital and killed 33. I pretty much don’t drive on it anymore. Hwy 176 parallels it and you stand a much smaller chance of crashing or getting stuck in traffic for hours. 

As a native South Carolinaian I’ve driven I26, I85, and I4.  berkeley the berkeley out of I4.  I’ll take I26 and I85 anyday over I4.

Well, I guess it’s a good thing I haven’t lost anything in FL and don’t really have a reason to go back. 

 

 

I think if you can name an interstate near a major city, it sucks exponentially worse than it did 20 years ago.  Looking at you, I-77 through Charlotte. 

Mndsm said:

i-4 is unique in that virtually nowhere else on earth will you encounter the sheer variety of drivers you will here. 

 

Remember, less than 40% of florida’s population is native to florida by birth. That means at any given time 60% or MORE of the people got their drivers license SOMEWHERE ELSE. They did not learn the intricacies of Florida driving. 

 

We also have the added benefit of being effectively the #1 tourist destination on earth, with i-4 passing past….all of it. If you wanna see the mouse, the minions, the whale, or any of it, you’re on I-4.

 

Let’s extrapolate that and add in the fact that…everyone hates tourists. So we all drive like we’re trying to kill them, because let’s be real, some of us are. Tourists drive like they paid for the section of road they’re on so they can do what they want with it. It’s a bad mix. 

 

Add in the fact that I-4 was never designed to do what it’s doing right now, let alone what it’s going to continue to do…forever. The Ultimate project won’t catch up. It’ll finish and we’ll have to start over again. And that’s all I can say about that without patio’ing this whole thing. 

 

There’s a reason I drive junk. I’m prepared to total my car on a daily basis. Ain’t worth owning something I like. 

Phoenix and Tucson are similar in that most of the people aren’t native, and they are aging. Those that are native freak the f out if it sprinkles. You’ve not experienced terrible driving until you’ve been in Tucson at the start of monsoon season. Those wipers haven’t been used in 9 months while baking in the southern arizona sun. Add in their unfamiliarity with wet stuff on road ways and its ….. a “treat”. 

Every place has it’s thing. Indy’s 465 loop long ago became the new speedway. If you’re not running 90+ in the 55 you’ll probably die. Semi’s are running 20+ over. Constant construction and never ending road degredation leaving craters randomly scattered makes it sucky. Rush hours are the same as I-4… mystery slow downs. I10 between Tucson and Phoenix I’ve never driven slower than 90…. and I was the slow one. 75 through atlanta at 3am is open season. I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve been running 90 through there and getting passed on both sides by cars running 110+. 24 through Chattanooga is so rough you spend half your time dodging the craters and the other half dodging the other drivers. Before 70 got its own bridge in St Louis that was a nightmare. 4 interstates coming together at once and then dispersing in all directions after and everyone was in a hurry mixed with Illinoid drivers. The Dan Ryan in Chi-town is never not destroyed and backed up for an hour. 75 just over the river from Cinci on the KY side is nuts. Especially during the weekday. How about NJ/NYC area? That isn’t for the weak hearted for sure. 

Doesn’t matter where you are, there are roads like or worse. 

Scotty Con Queso said:

I think if you can name an interstate near a major city, it sucks exponentially worse than it did 20 years ago.  Looking at you, I-77 through Charlotte. 

We used to go through Charlotte to visit my family.  Now we roll down towards Florence and catch 95.  By most navigation services, it is 5-15 minutes longer but that is without any traffic in Charlotte.  Way better for my sanity.  


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/9/23 9:17 a.m.

bobzilla said:

Mndsm said:

i-4 is unique in that virtually nowhere else on earth will you encounter the sheer variety of drivers you will here. 

 

Remember, less than 40% of florida’s population is native to florida by birth. That means at any given time 60% or MORE of the people got their drivers license SOMEWHERE ELSE. They did not learn the intricacies of Florida driving. 

 

We also have the added benefit of being effectively the #1 tourist destination on earth, with i-4 passing past….all of it. If you wanna see the mouse, the minions, the whale, or any of it, you’re on I-4.

 

Let’s extrapolate that and add in the fact that…everyone hates tourists. So we all drive like we’re trying to kill them, because let’s be real, some of us are. Tourists drive like they paid for the section of road they’re on so they can do what they want with it. It’s a bad mix. 

 

Add in the fact that I-4 was never designed to do what it’s doing right now, let alone what it’s going to continue to do…forever. The Ultimate project won’t catch up. It’ll finish and we’ll have to start over again. And that’s all I can say about that without patio’ing this whole thing. 

 

There’s a reason I drive junk. I’m prepared to total my car on a daily basis. Ain’t worth owning something I like. 

Phoenix and Tucson are similar in that most of the people aren’t native, and they are aging. Those that are native freak the f out if it sprinkles. You’ve not experienced terrible driving until you’ve been in Tucson at the start of monsoon season. Those wipers haven’t been used in 9 months while baking in the southern arizona sun. Add in their unfamiliarity with wet stuff on road ways and its ….. a “treat”. 

Every place has it’s thing. Indy’s 465 loop long ago became the new speedway. If you’re not running 90+ in the 55 you’ll probably die. Semi’s are running 20+ over. Constant construction and never ending road degredation leaving craters randomly scattered makes it sucky. Rush hours are the same as I-4… mystery slow downs. I10 between Tucson and Phoenix I’ve never driven slower than 90…. and I was the slow one. 75 through atlanta at 3am is open season. I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve been running 90 through there and getting passed on both sides by cars running 110+. 24 through Chattanooga is so rough you spend half your time dodging the craters and the other half dodging the other drivers. Before 70 got its own bridge in St Louis that was a nightmare. 4 interstates coming together at once and then dispersing in all directions after and everyone was in a hurry mixed with Illinoid drivers. The Dan Ryan in Chi-town is never not destroyed and backed up for an hour. 75 just over the river from Cinci on the KY side is nuts. Especially during the weekday. How about NJ/NYC area? That isn’t for the weak hearted for sure. 

Doesn’t matter where you are, there are roads like or worse. 

What you’ve described in a Tuscon monsoon is the first snow of a Minnesota winter. 

COME ON PEOPLE. It snows every berkeleying year (and it’s the reason I moved to florida to be part of that 60% that didn’t get my drivers license here). Yall remember how to ride a bike. Remember how to drive in some dammit snow.

In reply to Mndsm :

same here as well. B/S business skyrockets first snow.

 

A question related to I-4.

Heading west into Orlando, so around Lake Mary, there’s an illuminated sign almost always warning of STOPPED TRAFFIC AHEAD.

I have wondered, if that sign did not exist, would the traffic also cease to exist? 

David S. Wallens said:

A question related to I-4.

Heading west into Orlando, so around Lake Mary, there’s an illuminated sign almost always warning of STOPPED TRAFFIC AHEAD.

I have wondered, if that sign did not exist, would the traffic also cease to exist? 

Now that you mention that…..there is also one going east between like Lakeland and Auburndale. 

In reply to RonnieFnD :

Yes, that one, too–saw it while heading home from Tampa recently.

Do people see the sign and check up? Somewhere there’s a psychology experiment in here. 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/9/23 10:22 a.m.

In reply to David S. Wallens :

You present an interesting hypothesis. 

 

On one hand- the sign exists to warn others of an impending slowdown, much like brake lights. This is theoretically good- because people don’t pay attention when they got that Don Miguel XXL from 7-11 to get down on (don’t act like you’re too good for it). HOWEVER- 

 

Much like a brake check can cause a giant backup miles down the road due to a chain reaction (as anyone that’s driven i-4…anywhere can attest to) is the panic state of warning people in advance causing more slow down than it needs to? What happens if we just…. don’t? 

Toyman! said:

I can’t imagine that I4 is any worse than I26 in South Carolina. 

The fast lane running 90. The slow lane running 60. Oh, you wanted a middle lane? Funny boy, we don’t spend money to fix the gargantuan holes or fill the ruts that are literally worn into the asphalt, much less add another lane. 

Can confirm. If you’re not doing at least 90 on that road, you’re getting run over. And the parts of the road that aren’t potholed or rutted are like a cheese grater. At those speeds on that surface, I’m pretty impressed that my tires aren’t bald by the time I get to Charleston.

I saw a cop on that highway once. Once. He was either napping or too engrossed in his donut to enforce anything.

I-4 through Orlando is terrible and it’ll be under construction indefinitely. 

While the outer stretches are pretty straight…the downtown orlando stretch has a bunch few curves which normal people should slow down for.  The box trucks usually disagree. I think I do see more absolutely crazy stuff per mile on I-4 than elsewhere.  If I’m going through there I’ll often pay to use the express/toll lanes just to stay away from the crazies in the 4-lane thunderdome.  Any time I’m head west through FL i tend to opt to drive through Ocala National Forest.  Google Maps might say it’s slower, but it’s way more predictable.  And, central FL is kind of interesting to drive through.

With that said, I-75 around Tampa is less chaotic…but very, very fast.  My son and I have a running running joke that there’s no rules once you’re within 50 miles of tampa on I-75.  

I used to joke that the Capital Beltway in DC (and I -95 in general) was actually safest at rush hour…because people driving in heavy traffic every day are generally pretty competent and efficient.  They drive door-to-door competently at 90 mph every day.  2 PM on the weekend was most dangerous because people who live in rural areas are thrown into the mix bewildered by the who experience.  

I drove from FL to NY last week.  The challenge w/Florida driving is the wide spectrum of drivers all going the same direction.  Fast clueless, fast aggressive, slow clueless, sporadic & staring at a phone…etc.   In other places drivers seems to clump around the median more.  I did notice in NY/NJ that in order to change lanes or merge you don’t signal so they can give you more room…you signal to tell people you’re moving.  Some people actively avoid a turn signal so they aren’t actively blocked.  

In reply to David S. Wallens :

I didnt notice it at first but got a good chuckle when i saw the i4 eyesore.  Good work!

 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/9/23 10:41 a.m.

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

I live close enough to it I don’t even see it anymore. I had to go back and look once you said that. It truly is a work of art. 

In reply to David S. Wallens :

Funny enough, I drove through that very same area the other day, and there was no stopped traffic.

I didn’t really know what to do with myself.

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

Thank you! How could we not add it?

Somehow, someway, that damn thing would survive the apocalypse, too.


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/9/23 11:20 a.m.

Colin Wood said:

In reply to TJL (Forum Supporter) :

Thank you! How could we not add it?

Somehow, someway, that damn thing would survive the apocalypse, too.

Well yeah- not like Joel’s gonna let anyone in in the event of a second coming…..

Some crazy stuff I have seen on I-4 just lately:

A new red Supra slicing up through traffic like he was being chased by a Terminator–at least 20 faster than everyone else, zero turn signals, using all the lanes from one extreme to the other. Traffic was heavy but moving. 

The same but this time a red Camry.

A silver WRX also following that M.O. but using the striped part of an off-ramp as well as the breakdown lane to get that extra jump on traffic. 

And, yes, I use the I-4 express lane. As a friend noted, it’s like insurance. We’ve also been taking 429 around town. 

For those who dont know, the “i4 eyesore” is an awkwardly large building that was funded by stealing money from old ladies via “televangelism”. Literally claiming that if you give them $$, then it would increase the likelihood  that god would favor them or whatever.  Completely rotten criminal behavior.  Its a monument to bilking elderlies out of their retirement $$. 
 

The controversy does not stop there. The funding dried up long before the building was completed(ha, its still not “completed”), so this shell of a huge criminal building sat there forever with maybe a crane in place so they could claim it was still “under construction”.   

As a Florida born and raised individual I can’t argue the points given here. This is all part of the reason I moved to SE Georgia. Let me offer a few other possibly  close comparisons: I75 in the Atlanta metro area at any time other than 1-5 am. The seaming eternally under construction I75/I16 interchange in Macon.  Also have to agree with a previous poster in regards to I26 in SC.

The I-4 eyesore has its own Wikipedia entry.

Veteran’s HWY in Metairie, LA where Causeway Blvd. and Clearview Pkwy. cross. At one time they were rated the two most dangerous intersections in the country according to auto insurance companies. You could be first in line at a red light, the light turns green and you count to three before going and STILL get t-boned by someone running the red light. These two intersections are only a few miles apart.

David S. Wallens said:

The I-4 eyesore has its own Wikipedia entry.

We have this bizarre building in Tulsa, also built by a televangelist.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/abundant-life-building

Who then built his own university in south Tulsa in the 60s. 

Also built this complex across the street from the ORU campus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CityPlex_Towers

 

 


aw614


aw614


HalfDork


11/9/23 2:36 p.m.

Forgot about Dinosaur world in Plant City laugh

I75 in tampa I agree is very fast, in the GTI, I find myself going 90+ just to keep up, and its perfectly fine. But I really hated cruising in the Integra at 85+. It’s usually right near that VTEC engagement point. I found going north on I75 towards Ocala I tend to drive far more relaxed, and it usually feels that way most times of the day. Going south to go home, all bets are off, feels like everyone is going faster going south lol

I recently did I-75 south to Venice. Traffic was heavy but moving along at a good clip. 

Lof8 – Andy said:

#1 Deadlist Road, 2021

I drive it frequently.  Its always terrible, its always under construction.  I do everything I can to avoid it when possible.

That website won’t load, so you’re going to have to give me a hint… 

I-4 sounds like an average day on the PATP or I-95 through PA.  The speed limit is a mere suggestion… at least on the TP it’s 70 MPH, so when the flow of traffic is 90 the slower lanes don’t seem as out of place. The 55 limit on 95 is laughable. On the rare occasion there’s a State Trooper, they won’t even look at you unless you’re doing over 70.  Getting passed by someone doing 100+ isn’t uncommon. In my younger days, that someone was often me.  To be honest, the problem is usually out-of-state drivers who don’t understand how fast PA drivers can be. 

On the plus side, we don’t have to worry about anyone passing in the left breakdown lane… since that lane doesn’t exist on either road. 

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

Lof8 – Andy said:

#1 Deadlist Road, 2021

I drive it frequently.  Its always terrible, its always under construction.  I do everything I can to avoid it when possible.

That website won’t load, so you’re going to have to give me a hint… 

I-4 sounds like an average day on the PATP or I-95 through PA.  The speed limit is a mere suggestion… at least on the TP it’s 70 MPH, so when the flow of traffic is 90 the slower lanes don’t seem as out of place. The 55 limit on 95 is laughable. On the rare occasion there’s a State Trooper, they won’t even look at you unless you’re doing over 70.  Getting passed by someone doing 100+ isn’t uncommon. In my younger days, that someone was often me.  To be honest, the problem is usually out-of-state drivers who don’t understand how fast PA drivers can be. 

On the plus side, we don’t have to worry about anyone passing in the left breakdown lane… since that lane doesn’t exist on either road. 

The turnpike and 95 in PA are a berkeleying dream compared to I4.  I moved up to West Chester for for work for a few years so I am very familiar with both.

Also worth noting….Florida doesn’t require safety inspections.  Heck, they don’t even inspect the VIN for vehicles worth a Florida title.  

In reply to Hoondavan :

Shhhh … don’t give away all of our secrets.  The NY and PA tags will overtake us.

Stampie said:

In reply to Hoondavan :

Shhhh … don’t give away all of our secrets.  The NY and PA tags will overtake us.

I thought they were already here?  I heard the city council is working on changing the name Tampa to Greater New York. 

RonnieFnD said:

Stampie said:

In reply to Hoondavan :

Shhhh … don’t give away all of our secrets.  The NY and PA tags will overtake us.

I thought they were already here?  I heard the city council is working on changing the name Tampa to Greater New York. 

Well…at least the cost of living isn’t considered cheap anymore, that should slow down the migration at least a little bit right?  Oh year, that and sea level rise, ocean warming + hurricanes, uber-expensive car insurnace due to PIP scams and terrible drivers, uber-expensive home insurance (hurricanes), sinkholes, alligators, crocodiles, man-eating snakes, and the abundance of shifty characters and con-artists.  GIANT SPIDERS, termites, cockroaches, generally massive bugs.  Most of the state has zero elevation change and no curvy roads.

Also, FLORIDA MAN

Three Ways to Spot a Fake Floridian: Florida Man Viral on TikTok for Sunshine State-Relatable Content Lays Down "Real" Floridian Rules 

    

I’ve personally witnessed more accidents since moving to the Tampa area than I have in the entirety of the rest of my life.  Including when I was deployed.  Those guys like to bump the guy in front of them when they’re going too slow.

 

Meme not related to I-4, but relevant

#comics from Chronotope

In reply to Mr_Asa 

Good representation there.

And since the DC beltway is partially in Maryland, correct.


Duke


Duke


MegaDork


11/10/23 12:53 p.m.

David S. Wallens said:

Heading west into Orlando, so around Lake Mary, there’s an illuminated sign almost always warning of STOPPED TRAFFIC AHEAD.

Do people see the sign and check up? Somewhere there’s a psychology experiment in here. 

It’s the vehicular equivalent of the voicemail announcement to “Please listen carefully, because our menu options have recently changed.”

No they berking haven’t; that’s a lie.  You’re just trying to trick me into paying attention.

 


Duke


Duke


MegaDork


11/10/23 1:02 p.m.

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

To be honest, the problem is usually out-of-state drivers who don’t understand how fast PA drivers can be.

That’s because y’all immediately default to 10 under as soon as you cross the state line out of Pennsylvania.

 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

also, i-85 through Greenville SC is a bit of a nightmare as well

Funny that we both know Detroit AND Greenville SC.  I concur about I85… 

Nah.  285 around ATL is it.  Altimas everywhere, performing amazing feats of life endangerment at every turn.

The positive is that there are so many wrecks at every hour, the cops don’t have time to stop speeders (vicious circle).

In reply to rustomatic :

I saw two Altimas trying out Altima each other today and I’m 6 hrs from Atlanta.  Atlanta is something else….


Duke


Duke


MegaDork


11/10/23 5:00 p.m.

Noddaz said:

In reply to Mr_Asa 

Good representation there.

And since the DC beltway is partially in Maryland, correct.

Needs moar speeding ticket from officious cop in the Virginia panel.

 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/10/23 6:00 p.m.

Mr_Asa said:

I’ve personally witnessed more accidents since moving to the Tampa area than I have in the entirety of the rest of my life.  Including when I was deployed.  Those guys like to bump the guy in front of them when they’re going too slow.

 

Meme not related to I-4, but relevant

#comics from Chronotope

Shiny and chrome, baby. That’s why we do drugs. It’s just so we can drive to work. 

rustomatic said:

Nah.  285 around ATL is it.  Altimas everywhere, performing amazing feats of life endangerment at every turn.

The positive is that there are so many wrecks at every hour, the cops don’t have time to stop speeders (vicious circle).

Way, way back in the day, I knew a dude who said he was building “a race car.”

What kind? I asked. Figured it was for an SCCA class or something.

A 285 race car, he replied. 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/10/23 9:20 p.m.

In reply to David S. Wallens :

Y’know, that’s an option i’ve joked about in the past. What would I build for I-4. Now, the asshat in me said m35a2 with a Chrysler Imperial body- very Mad Max indeed. But- Ma deuce only goes 45mph. She will ALWAYS go 45mph, but…. that’s not I-4 material.

 

I DO, however- possess a derelict, and very much worthless to anyone but me……2007 Mazdaspeed3. We’ve talked about this car many many moons ago. I’m the idiot that did the front sway install on the ground in a friends driveway. Violently unpleasant, that. I think i’d almost remarry my ex-wife before doing that job again. 

 

What if…. it were shiny and chrome? Not full on war boy wagon with spikes and stuff, but what if I designed it with battle on I-4 in mind? I’m already strongly considering going 6″ or so the opposite direction from where it sits now (roughly 3″ lower than stock, if memory serves). You can 3d print and laser cut and whatever damn near anything these days…….

Looks like I’m doing a photo shoot Sunday in Orlando.

Wish me luck. 

FWIW, I only have to get to Princeton. 

Mndsm said:

In reply to David S. Wallens :

Y’know, that’s an option i’ve joked about in the past. What would I build for I-4. Now, the asshat in me said m35a2 with a Chrysler Imperial body- very Mad Max indeed. But- Ma deuce only goes 45mph. She will ALWAYS go 45mph, but…. that’s not I-4 material.

Truck.  Old truck. Ford, Chevy, Dodge, doesn’t matter.  Big ole engine.  Auto trans.
I-beam bumpers fore and aft that stick out at least 6″ past the body on each side.  Minimum beam size of something like a W14 x 61


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/12/23 10:24 a.m.

Mr_Asa said:

Mndsm said:

In reply to David S. Wallens :

Y’know, that’s an option i’ve joked about in the past. What would I build for I-4. Now, the asshat in me said m35a2 with a Chrysler Imperial body- very Mad Max indeed. But- Ma deuce only goes 45mph. She will ALWAYS go 45mph, but…. that’s not I-4 material.

Truck.  Old truck. Ford, Chevy, Dodge, doesn’t matter.  Big ole engine.  Auto trans.
I-beam bumpers fore and aft that stick out at least 6″ past the body on each side.  Minimum beam size of something like a W14 x 61

Mpg is a concern. Doesn’t matter if you’re going 2 exits or Tampa to Daytona, gonna take you 3 hours. I could Diesel, but Florida man tax. There IS the concept of a 6bt mech ramcharger but…..

Made it home alive, but I-4‘s gonna I-4.

Not bad going in. I was following a silver Boxster into town. We’re in the left lane moving along just fine. Middle and right lanes also full but not moving as quickly.

Nondescript silver-ish car passes both of us on the right and, somehow, slices just in front of the Boxster. I let out an audible gasp and I don’t know how we didn’t have metal-on-metal. No brake lights from the Boxster. 

After making the pass, silver-ish car then goes all the way to the right lane and repeats.

This is when the silver Altima behind me went into Altima mode and did the same. 

Fortunately, very soon after I hit the I-4 Express lane. 

I got off at Ivanhoe and saw, I kid you not, a dude entering the I-4 on-ramp on an old-school minibike. He was wearing a helmet, so I guess it’s okay. 

Not nearly as crazy coming home but lots of cars in both directions. There was a wreck on I-95 just north of I-4, and I got tied up in that. 

Had fun in Orlando but good to be home.  

 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/12/23 8:06 p.m.

In reply to David S. Wallens :

We were travelling I-4 near camping world and saw a squad pulled over and lit up. Saw the officer out and talking to someone. Realized that someone did not have a vehicle. ANYWHERE. Apparently we were just out for a stroll. I-4 things. 

In reply to Mndsm :

Maybe it was my dude with the minibike. 

 

I have an 80 mile daily commute from eastern Pasco County to south Tampa. I hate it. 

I live right off of US-19 in New Port Richey. I try to avoid 19 if at all possible.

https://baynews9.com/fl/tampa/news/2022/08/01/u-s–19-in-pasco-county-ranks-as-one-of-country-s-most-deadly-roads

 


Mndsm


Mndsm


MegaDork


11/13/23 9:30 a.m.

David S. Wallens said:

In reply to Mndsm :

Maybe it was my dude with the minibike. 

Unless the homie was a 300lb woman…..

I have a 35 year love-hate thing with I-4.
Living in Altamonte, working first in Lakeland, then Lake Mary, then Tampa, then at Disney, I’ve seen the good/bad/ugly,
I’ve endured so many construction cycles to ‘fix’ the problems … I’ve lost count.

That said, as a traveling software consultant I’ve lived and commuted in traffic in Chicago, Atlanta, LA, Charlotte, Detroit, New York City, Newark, Miami, St Louis, San Francisco, Singapore, Frankfort, Medellin, and Jakarta.

They all sucked.



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